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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Michael Katz (chef)

Michael Katz (chef)

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Michael Katz (chef) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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non-notable, advert, no coverage in reliable sources about Katz. Polygnotus (talk) 16:36, 29 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Previously at AFD, ineligible for soft deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 23:36, 5 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 23:56, 12 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: He has received substantial independent coverage in reliable sources. I have added sources that further strengthen this: Makor Rishon profiles his culinary achievements, the Jerusalem Post highlights his founding of the Attilio culinary school, The Israel National News sources detail his international representation, Ynet notes that he taught at the Cordon Bleu in London, and Walla! Food explains his previous role as head chef of Edom (Adom) restaurants in Jerusalem. Combined with earlier coverage including the Sydney Morning Herald and the Times of Israel, these sources demonstrate Katz’s notability through his professional accomplishments and influence on Israeli cuisine. Orlando Davis (talk) 02:28, 13 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I just found two additional sources from a previous deletion discussion about Katz that ended in Keep: Dining: A Gourmet Experience, which notes that he is a member of Belgium’s Association of Master Chefs, and Israeli Cuisine with Chef Michael Katz, which describes him as one of Israel’s top chefs. I also added links to the books Israel: The Complete Guide with Biblical Sites, Desert Adventures and Seaside Resorts (Abdou et al., 1999) and The Chef’s Kitchen (Aner & Rabin, 1999), which are reliable, independently published sources from recognized publishers, and provide verifiable coverage of Michael Katz’s professional work, and therefore further support his notability on Wikipedia.” Orlando Davis (talk) 03:10, 13 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Orlando Davis Can you show me the WP:BESTTHREE? Katz does not (yet) meet WP:GNG. Polygnotus (talk) 13:20, 13 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I’m not sure which three sources are the absolute best because I haven’t read them all yet, but these three are definitely solid:
  • The Jerusalem Post — a well-known English-language Israeli daily with a reputation for editorial independence — provides independent coverage of Katz’s career, including his training in Michelin-star kitchens, teaching at Le Cordon Bleu in London, and his role at Adom/Edom restaurants. This is not an interview, as it is a review of the food he prepared.
  • The Philippine Daily Inquirer’s lifestyle section, part of a major broadsheet with editorial oversight, reviews Katz’s cuisine and gives meaningful coverage of his professional work. (Philippine Daily Inquirer – Wikipedia) This is also a review, not an interview.
  • The Times of Israel is a reliable independent source that reviews Katz’s food rather than interviewing him, confirming his role as a chef and highlighting his professional prominence. It also notes his membership in the Belgian Association of Master Chefs and his teaching at Le Cordon Bleu in London.
All three sources are independent, secondary, and not self-published, meeting Wikipedia’s general notability guideline (WP:N). You can see how Wikipedia evaluates the Jerusalem Post and the Times of Israel here: (Wikipedia: Reliable sources – Perennial sources)
Thank you for your time and input! Orlando Davis (talk) 18:19, 13 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Orlando Davis No I mean sources that provide significant coverage about Michael Katz. Significant coverage addresses the topic directly and in detail.
  • jpost contains 7 sentences about him, hardly in-depth.
  • lifestyle.inquirer.net is a lifestyle blog. Sure, it is hosted on the same domain, but it isn't a reliable source since it is a lifestyle blog; not a reliable source of information. Interviews are where journalists write down what people say, not an independent source of information. It contains 6 sentences about him.
  • That ToI link contains 4 sentences about him, if we are generous. So that doesn't meet WP:INDEPTH.
Polygnotus (talk) 23:36, 13 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Also, do you have a COI or do you get paid to edit? Because dude worked at a booth at a tourism fair (according to the source) for 5 days and you describe that as him being "an ambassador of Israeli cuisine". Polygnotus (talk) 23:42, 13 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Please assume good faith. I have no conflict of interest; I’m taking part in this discussion because I believe the subject meets Wikipedia’s notability guidelines. The article also passed a deletion review in 2019, which further supports its long-term notability.
To help address the sourcing concerns raised here, I’ve added three additional reliable secondary sources, including the books The Jewish Kitchen, and The Foods of Israel, and an article from Haaretz. I initially thought the existing sources were sufficient to demonstrate notability under WP:GNG and WP:SIGCOV, but since questions remain, I’m happy to continue improving the article. I’ve already identified several more high-quality sources that can be added.
I’m committed to working collaboratively to ensure the article aligns with policy and is supported by strong, verifiable sourcing. Orlando Davis (talk) 00:21, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Orlando Davis Are you saying that people who have a conflict of interest/are getting paid must be editing in bad faith?? Are you sure ? The rules are quite clear: paid editing is allowed, although disclosure is required. COI editing is allowed, and advice is provided how to do it properly.
I object to you characterizing all paid editors and all people with a conflicts of interest as bad faith editors.
People keep showing up on Wikipedia to passionately defend some obscure chef who never really achieved much in the culinary world. That includes multiple accounts by paid editors but also the username "Chef Michael Katz". And since you write about builders of scale models of ships and Michael Katz builds scale models of ships it is difficult to not see a connection.
The fact that a book contains a recipe by him doesn't really do much for notability. What we need is significant coverage in reliable sources, independent of the subject. Polygnotus (talk) 00:34, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I didn’t mean to imply that COI editing is bad faith, and I apologize if it came across that way—that wasn’t my intention.
Regarding The Jewish Kitchen: the book mentions Katz’s recipes on pages 18, 35, 157, and 158, and also notes that his restaurant, Michael Andrews, was highly acclaimed. Please give me a bit more time, as I’m still working through several additional sources I’ve found. Orlando Davis (talk) 01:04, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I collaborated with a paid editor, and have helped a bunch of COI editors. As long as they are willing to follow our rules they are welcome.
Bad faith edits are vandalism, hoaxes, trolling et cetera.
WP:RELIST says In general, a discussion should not be relisted more than twice but we are not in a hurry and there is no deadline so I don't have objections to relisting for a third or fourth time. Polygnotus (talk) 01:35, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
What we lack is reliable sources with significant coverage about Michael Katz. All these sources that just mention his name, but aren't actually about him, do not contribute to notability. Polygnotus (talk) 02:18, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I’d like to note that I have added 28 sources to the Michael Katz article, most of them after my last edit. While many of these sources were recently removed by another editor (you can verify them in the article history), I’ve listed some below to provide context and help other editors evaluate them. I believe these sources further support the article’s case for notability. It’s also worth mentioning that there has been additional coverage since the last AfD on this article, which resulted in a Keep.
  • Haaretz – Multiple articles describe his restaurants’ impact, challenges due to local conflicts, and recognition as a culinary leader. (Most of the Haaretz sources can be found through the Wikipedia Library for free)
  • Ynet – New and Noteworthy in Jerusalem – Highlights that Katz has one of the most impressive credentials in Jerusalem’s culinary scene and is the only Israeli to have been a Cordon Bleu instructor in London.
  • Ynet – Lists Katz’s restaurant as one of the “must-see” destinations in Jerusalem.
  • Israel Eats (book) – Describes Katz’s international career as a chef and culinary consultant in over 20 countries. By clicking on the preview button on the top of the page, and typing Katz on the search engine on the left bottom, you will find the information I provided.
  • Israel TV 13 – Reports that Katz taught many of Israel’s greatest chefs and details his reinterpretation of Michelin-inspired dishes.
  • TV13 – Reports on nationwide competitions he launched to promote street-food cooking in Israel.
  • Timeout Magazine – Discusses his charitable initiatives through Attilio, including volunteering to prepare and deliver meals nationwide.
  • Shavvim – Notes that Michael Katz is “world renowned” as a chef.
  • Foodis – Highlights the Attilio cooking school he owns, its mission, and its educational initiatives.
  • Walla Food – Highlights his role at Aluma, a gourmet kosher restaurant, emphasizing his classical European training and creativity within kashrut.
Orlando Davis (talk) 17:18, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry to post again — I just thought that anyone interested in checking the Haaretz articles through the Wikipedia Library might find these helpful. They offer additional context and may be useful for evaluating coverage:
  • Palti, Michal. "It's a War on Fine Food in the Capital." Haaretz, 23 Oct. 2001.
  • Katz, Michael. "What Does It Really Mean to Be a Chef?" Haaretz, 22 Nov. 2015.
  • Wissenshtern, Elkana, and Rina Rozenberg Kandel. “Security Situation Hits Jerusalem Business Hard: ‘Mahane…’” Haaretz, 14 Nov. 2014.
  • “Retail Sales Continue to Slide, Especially in Jerusalem.” Haaretz, 21 Oct. 2015. Accessed 13 Nov. 2025.
  • “The Temptations of ‘Trattoria Haba’ in Jerusalem.” Haaretz, 10 Jan. 2014. Accessed 13 Nov. 2025.
  • Vered, Ronit. “Winter on the Mount of Olives.” Haaretz, 3 Feb. 2012. Accessed 13 Nov. 2025.
Again, sorry for taking up extra space — there are just so many articles that seem relevant, and I hope this helps anyone who wants to look into them. I’m going to step back from the article for now. Thanks so much, everyone! Orlando Davis (talk) 17:32, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Please don't apologize, feel free to post as much and as many times as you want. Did you manage to find any that provide significant coverage about him? I was unable to. See WP:BESTTHREE WP:INDEPTH WP:SIGCOV for the kinda stuff we are looking for: 3 reliable independent sources that provide significant in-depth coverage. Thanks, Polygnotus (talk) 17:53, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I would highlight Haaretz, Ynet, and TV13 as strong sources, though there are many others that also provide meaningful coverage. As explained in Wikipedia:Significance is not a formula, “Significant coverage” addresses the topic directly and in detail, so that no original research is needed to extract the content. Significant coverage is more than a trivial mention, but it does not need to be the main topic of the source material. See also Wikipedia:Notability. Many of the sources I’ve added are documented in the article history and are available on this talk page for review.
This article is clearly notable. I believe further debate on this is unlikely to change that. Even if the article were deleted, I am confident it would be quickly accepted through the Articles for Creation process, as Michael Katz clearly meets Wikipedia’s notability guidelines. I will now step back from this discussion. Orlando Davis (talk) 19:35, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Crediting a chef for recipes isn't really enough. Reviews of his restaurants isn't enough. Awards that aren't themselves notable isn't enough. We need lengthy discussion of the chef himself. Valereee (talk) 16:54, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • Leaning delete. Lots of mentions, but I'm not finding much sigcov, so if someone can point me at something I'm missing that isn't just a bare mention or isn't just him being quoted at length, I'm kind of stumped. With this number of mentions, I'm a bit surprised we aren't finding a lengthy bio in Israeli media. Israel has food journalism. This article has the distinct feel of a folder of clippings of every time he's ever been mentioned being handed to a not-very-experienced editor-for-hire, so I feel like if there were actual sig cov out there, we'd be seeing it. Transliteration makes things difficult, but I'll try to do some more research. Valereee (talk) 16:40, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]
    Literally finding nothing via a Google search and filtering by 'News'. Valereee (talk) 16:56, 14 November 2025 (UTC)[reply]